Thread: Ball position in your stance

For quite a while I have been having issues with topping the ball or duffing it. Part of the reason is that I slide my hips away from the target during my take away, and then towards the target during my down swing. It is a timing nightmare that often opens or closes the club face unpredictably, and changes the bottom of my swing arc drastically.

So, to reduce the amount of mishits and straighten out my shits a little, I have been working on reducing the amount of hip slide. When I am not sliding my hips, my shots are much more accurate and the ball flights are much nicer, if just a tad shorter.

However, changing the amount of hip slide has created a different problem. I've had to change the ball position in my stance according to which club I am hitting. My nephew who is a +1 HC advised me to start with the driver off the left heel, and move the ball position a half or 3/4 golfball width back for each shorter club, with the 5i being about in the center of my stance.

A quick search on Youtube came up with the following...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtYoSQq7-6s&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiFojI31fe8&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ87eGG0svo&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AClNxjXJbE&feature=related


With these in mind and your current tendencies, what are your thoughts about the position of the ball in your stance? A different one for each club? Or 3-6 different positions to cover all the clubs?

Originally Posted by alongdriver

With these in mind and your current tendencies, what are your thoughts about the position of the ball in your stance? A different one for each club? Or 3-6 different positions to cover all the clubs?

Since you're asking. For me, not only does the ball position change a bit, but I change my stance and swing too depending on the club.
Though, one also needs to consider the lie of the ball and the type of shot to make as well. There's a lot of variables, but I suspect, lots of great players probably don't think so much about it and go more off of feel and memory of what works for them.

Originally Posted by Goober

Since you're asking. For me, not only does the ball position change a bit, but I change my stance and swing too depending on the club.
Though, one also needs to consider the lie of the ball and the type of shot to make as well. There's a lot of variables, but I suspect, lots of great players probably don't think so much about it and go more off of feel and memory of what works for them.

Thanks Goober Yes, certainly. I used to be able to shape shots a little, but that was when I practiced almost every day, and played at least twice a week. Now, I just hope to keep it consistently going one direction. Since my ball flight was pretty bad the other day while practicing, I began playing around with the ball positions and noticed that about half a ball further forward than normal ironed the direction out a tad. I tried moving the ball back to create more backspin, but pretty much made things worse. My stance, left arm, swing plane... and just about everything else was out of whack, so basically now, I am just trying to fix the setup first so that once that is consistent, then I can work on the worst things in order. After a while I can work on downhill and uphill lies, ball higher or lower ...etc.

I have worked out that it is not so much where in the stance the ball is, but how far from it I am standing, after I hit it!

Originally Posted by Backswing

I have worked out that it is not so much where in the stance the ball is, but how far from it I am standing, after I hit it!

That's what I'm talking about.

"Forget straight, how far can you hit a (insert club of your choice) ?"

Speaking of which, I have to find a range with real balls, so I can "distance" my clubs again. For a while I have been thinking about left to right misses, and not so much on long or short misses (when I do make good contact).

Worked again on placing the ball about 1/2 a ball width more forward than normal again last night, keeping my left arm straight in the take away, not sliding my hips, stopping at the top and accelerating through ball instead of trying to tattoo it. Usually I try to fix one thing at a time, but for some reason, cluttering up my head with all that stuff shook out a good practice session. Well for every club except my SW. My normally most accurate club performed about as well as an unanchored trebuchet filled with glitter.

The new ball positions are working nicely, but the hip slide has been reduced so much that other issues affect my ball flight more. So, I'll get back to reducing the hip slide to a more optimal amount later.

Now, a major issue is my driver. Luckily I won the raffle to get my driver fitted at Cool Clubs. I will write about that in the other thread.

This proves that golf is all about distance.

"The six inches between your ears"

I agree, but too much hip slide occasionally lead to a 6 inch divot behind the ball that peeled a strip of turf up and over my ball. I wasn't really sure how to count that, so I just took another swing which flung the ball and the 6 inch long strip of turf a few yards ahead.

PWeb, I was successful in moving the ball back for my driver, almost to the hell line, without too many pulls or slices. My ball trajectory lowered, and is probably in the 13*-15* range. Spin seems less as I didn't see much ballooning, but I'll have to have that checked just to be sure.

It's official, in my case, moving the ball forward (along with keeping my left arm straighter in the takeaway, smoothly accelerating through the ball and not over rotating) has done quite a bit to improve consistency. Previously, I basically had a different ball position for each club which was about 1/2 a ball difference per club. Without actually measuring it, I'd say about 1/4 of a ball difference per club is working for me now.
Now, let's see how it works on the course this Friday. If my score goes North I am blaming the Mojitos

Originally Posted by alongdriver

Now, let's see how it works on the course this Friday. If my score goes North I am blaming the Mojitos

Good luck with that! If it's not the Mojitos, it'll be HH's Sapporo's

Originally Posted by Granto

Good luck with that! If it's not the Mojitos, it'll be HH's Sapporo's

My score went South, the good South. I wanna say it was the beer, but HH and Toshi-san did a stand-up job of showing me the course.

The new ball positions worked out great however, my most horrendous mishit was a 3-wood from the rough that went about 100 meters.

My best hole however was the par 5 18th. My driver was working great all day, and from the blue tee I hit another nice drive that disappeared over the hill, and landed in the fairway. The pin was about in the middle of the green, but was hidden from view behind the last tree on the right side. HH made a statement about reaching the green in 2 which essentially meant I lacked a pair if I didn't go for it. I lined up my shot directly at the tree, kept my left arm straight, put a good swing on the ball, made perfect contact and watched my ball disappear exactly over the tree. HH and I tracked the ball as well as we could, and heard a thud. The shot felt great. Walking out from behind the tree, we looked at the green and couldn't quite make out where the ball was. As we walked closer I thought I saw my ball just a little to the right and a little short of the hole. After walking a bit further it was clear that my ball was pretty close to the pin.

In the excitement, we weren't paying much attention to Toshi-san's shot from the left side. I caught the end of his swing but couldn't see his ball due to it being the same color as the clouds. Sorry about that Toshi-san

I missed the 5 footer eagle putt, but made the 20cm birdie

Andy, great to meet you mate.

Awesome day.

Good to meet a real long driver. (That should get a few bites! )

Decent dig on 13 too to get down the bottom.

18th was pure (well apart from that brave birdie attempt! )

Originally Posted by Hooked Hacker

Andy, great to meet you mate.

Awesome day.

Good to meet a real long driver. (That should get a few bites! )

Decent dig on 13 too to get down the bottom.

18th was pure (well apart from that brave birdie attempt! )

I agree, that was an awesome day.

Thanks, I forgot about the drive on the 13th, but I do remember your approach

That birdie putt had me trembling a bit, but I putted it hard enough to take the break out of it.

How'd you like my 100 yard approach though? Probably the cleanest contact and straightest ball I hit all day. Too bad I was aiming the wrong direction or I would have had 2 strokes less on my score card.

Seriously though, I had a great time and looking forward to the next round with you guys.

Okay, I've got the ball positions ironed out. Solid contact consistency improved quite a bit when the ball position was moved forward in my stance for everything except my driver, which was online with my little toe. Now it is just inside my big toe. Still fading and sometimes slicing it at the range, but not as much with the old ball position.

My friend works at S-yard and brought a driver that he assembled at work. My ball flight with that driver was pretty nice, oftentimes a slight draw. It is on a Fujikura Motore shaft, the head is 1* closed, 9*, D-1, and it is a tad lighter (10 grams) than my current driver. I had to put it away though.

Next thing to work on is my ball flight.

Got the ball positions working nicely now, even making some pretty nice shots with the 3 iron occasionally. In addition, the swing is starting to feel quite natural without much forethought. It should be nice to see what happens on the course the next time I play.

I retired my 3 iron a year ago. My Adams hybrid's so much easier to hit consistently.

I refuse to give up my 3i. I am like the frog in the "Never Give Up" pic below...

Butch Harmon Says:
Butch Harmon on Ball Positioning Golf Lesson - YouTube

Thanks Geo. I've seen a few small clips of that technique. Due to my limited and unfounded knowledge of golf swings I've stayed away from that until now because it would mean moving the ball quite a bit more forward in my stance than where it is currently. I'll have to give it a whirl next time, but it could result in having to change quite a few other things in my swing.

I've been fighting a hook for years. Recently, I started changing my ball position, moving closer to the ball and this has steepened my swing plane and all but eliminated the hook.

As for moving the ball forward or backward in my stance, I've always followed the rule of more forward for longer clubs. The driver for example, will be played off the inside of my front foot. For full wedges I play the ball slightly back of center. If I want to keep the ball down and/or create more spin, I'll play it off the back foot, but this is more for pitches and chips than full shots.

I really don't think that one ought to have different swings for different ball positions, though. The proximity of the ball to you (how far away you are from the ball), on the other hand will by definition alter your swing plane - flattening as the ball is further away from you. If you fight a slice, stand further away from the ball.

Of course, your grip has a lot to do with slice/hook problems with a stronger grip promoting more of a hook, and vice versa. Similarly, opening or closing your stance impacts trajectory - with an open stance promoting a higher ball flight.

Finding the right combination for you is a matter of trial and error. Each person's body type will dictate which set up will maximize distance and accuracy. Taller players generally have a more upright plane, while shorter players tend to have flatter swings. Find a pro that has a body type similar to yours and copy it. If you're built like Lee Trevino, but try to swing like Tiger Woods, you will find it very hard to feel comfortable. Obviously, your clubs ought to be fitted to your body. Most people buy clubs off the rack and don't bother to have them measured to fit. Even a centimeter too long or short will have disastrous effects on your swing.

Once you are able to find the optimum mix of these variables (grip, ball position, stance), you will be able to build a swing plane that is comfortable and repeatable, giving you, with practice, the holy grail of golf - consistency.

Nicely put bilinguru.
When on the range, what do you do to help grove consistency?
I sometimes push my shots, but when I am warmed up, my normal ball flight for irons is pretty straight. A slight draw if anything. The past few practice sessions I have not been adjusting proximity, but I have been toying with swing plane and noticed exactly what you wrote. I was able to fade the ball a bit with a steeper swing plane and opening my stance a bit. When it is working, I try to hit 20-30 per club to help groove the swing into being more repeatable. Of course it is something different when actually playing because (1) it isn't grooved yet, and (2) I am really not warm enough on the course to pull it off as often as I'd like.

The drawback for me is that after practicing fading the ball with the irons that "feel" carries over into my woods and driver which produces some slices. Well, not "some". Almost all of them with the 3w and driver recently. This means I have to really concentrate with those 2 to not "pull" through the ball with my left side, but push through with my right side.

Play with proximity? I don't think so. I am not good enough to do that, especially on the course. It just leads to shanksville for me.

I'll keep toying with it though Thanks.

I have a problem with ball position - its too close to me after I hit it !!

Originally Posted by Gunner1810

I have a problem with ball position - its too close to me after I hit it !!

I see you are playing off a 9 so you prolly hit it plenty far
But I think we'd all like some extra swing speed. Speaking of SS I have a few links that may help increase it. Can't say what it's gonna do to other parts of the game though